Unsolved
13 Posts
0
10897
Making sense of the spaghetti pile of monitor series, numbers, designations
@DELL-FAQ(because this might make a good FAQ...)
At work I have a pair of older Dell 27" Ultrasharp 16:10 monitors (I forget the model) that I really like, and with current telework I want to replace *one* of my monitors at home (17" and 19") with *some* 27" model -- Dell or other. (I have an older Dell Inspiron 3847 tower.)
In trying to research monitors I've found that Dell has WAY too many models with often nit-picky differences for your customers' good, and even for the company's good. (I remember a case study in grad school decades ago that pointed out the advantages that a company got when they simplified their product line, but companies like Dell and (American) appliance manufacturers never seem to learn.)
When browsing the Dell website I came across a link to "our 27-inch monitor page", which listed 20 (yes, twenty) 27" monitors. That can't possibly be necessary, and it explained why it was almost impossible to properly research and choose a Dell model. Picking the top-reviewed MSI or Acer 27" model starts looking like the logical solution.
Creating a "Series and Model Comparison" Web page or FAQ entry could make sense out of the spaghetti pile of Dell naming conventions (assuming there's logic and actual meaning in the designations):
- There are at least 5 series: "U", "P", "S", "SE", and "E". (I might have missed some specialty lines.)
- I think U and P are the most "professional" and expensive, and I think E is the cheapest, but despite looking at *many* side-by-side spec comparisons, I'm still not clear on the difference between U and P, or between S and SE (or a *consistent* difference between those and U or P).
- I think U and P are the most "professional" and expensive, and I think E is the cheapest, but despite looking at *many* side-by-side spec comparisons, I'm still not clear on the difference between U and P, or between S and SE (or a *consistent* difference between those and U or P).
- Then there can be at least 4 different model *numbers* for any given monitor size – the size in inches followed by "16", "17", "18", or "19". (E.g. 2716, 2717, 2718, 2719) Some sizes may have 3 such endings, but some have more – 24" monitors also have 12, 15, and 20.
- At first I thought there was just an indication of general quality or performance as those ending 2 digits increased, but then it looked like the "17s" were better than the "19s" at certain things. So I have no clue how to interpret these model categories.
- At first I thought there was just an indication of general quality or performance as those ending 2 digits increased, but then it looked like the "17s" were better than the "19s" at certain things. So I have no clue how to interpret these model categories.
- After that number, there are letter suffixes that also seem to mean something, but I can't tell what (except that if they end in "C" it means a USB-C connection). I've seen (NOT including specialty models):
- H, HC, HR, HS
- D, DC, DG, DGF, DW, DX,
- Q
Taken together, that means that the Dell naming convention could have 220 variations for a *single size* of monitor! Of course, they don't offer *all* those combinations, but if you want to know what you're actually getting with each of their 20 or so 27" models, you'd need to understand all of the variations.
A good explanation of each of those parts of your model numbers might make it easier for customers to decide on a model, although since no retailer is going to carry all of them, the customer still might feel at a loss.
Customer decision-making AND Dell's own logistics and production costs might be improved by simplifying and consolidating the minor variations. Sometimes trying to squeeze every incremental-pricing dollar with nit-picky variations can be counterproductive.
jphughan
9 Legend
9 Legend
•
14K Posts
0
April 8th, 2020 04:00
@rsteer I agree it’s confusing, and it doesn’t help that Dell has changed things up over the years in terms of what features are associated with which model lines, what model lines exist at all, and even the meaning of a given suffix character. But I’ll try to help.
The first character is the model line.
After that, the first two numbers are diagonal size.
The next two numbers are the “model year” of the display, which took me a long time to figure out. And yes, sometimes the generational refreshes are very minor, potentially even just changes to display input connectors, bezel thickness, etc. You might have to find deep dive reviews of the displays to figure it out, although sometimes reviews of the newer display explicitly call out differences from the previous model.
The last character(s) typically indicates resolution, aspect ratio, panel technology, and more recently the presence of a USB-C input. But again, this has changed over the years, and except for USB-C displays, displays usually don’t have more than one letter here, even though any given display would have a particular resolution, aspect ratio, panel type. I suspect the letter used would have been based on what differentiated that display model from other similar models at the time it was introduced.
Hopefully this helps.
jphughan
9 Legend
9 Legend
•
14K Posts
0
April 8th, 2020 05:00
@rsteer Sorry for the triple post here, but while I may be wrong about this, I don’t think Dell ever made a 27” 16:10 display as you indicated. I believe they only made 16:10 displays in 24” (1920x1200) and 30” (2560x1600), plus some smaller sizes, whereas 27” displays have always been 16:9 (FHD, QHD, or 4K).
jphughan
9 Legend
9 Legend
•
14K Posts
0
April 8th, 2020 05:00
@rsteer in addition to my attempt at an explainer above, if you share what specifically you’re looking for and/or the displays that look similar to you, I may be able to make a recommendation and/or differentiate them for you. I realize your post is also intended as a general comment about the branding strategy and product planning overall, but if I can help with something specific, just let me know.
And in fairness, try looking at BenQ or Samsung someday. Their model lineups and model naming schemes are even more opaque!
rsteer
13 Posts
0
April 8th, 2020 11:00
@jphughan -- Thanks for the insights. (Though I'm hoping a Dell website manager or FAQ person takes note...)
There are actually quite a few 2-letter suffixes that seem to be common right now, like HR. And then there's DGF, which either means (if your interpretations are right) that it supports both the Nvidia *and* AMD sync protocols, or it breaks most of your interpretations. I personally was wondering if the "GF" referred to "gaming framerates", since those are the monitors which seem to have the highest refresh rates (I forget if it's 144Hz or 155Hz) and fast pixel response (~1ms).
rsteer
13 Posts
0
April 8th, 2020 12:00
@jphughan> I don’t think Dell ever made a 27” 16:10 display...
I forget the model number, but I believe the resolution was 1920 x 1280 or something like that -- very non-standard to my mind, but nice because a more square monitor usually results in slightly larger font size as default. (More vertical height for the specified ".) I originally thought it was a 30" but when I checked the model number I do recall noting that it began with "27". In their day they were VERY expensive.
jphughan
9 Legend
9 Legend
•
14K Posts
0
April 8th, 2020 12:00
@rsteer There's never been 1920x1280 to my knowledge, but 16:10 would be 1920x1200. However, I don't recall that ever being used on a 27" display, especially an old one, and if it was, the pixel density would have been well below the 96 ppi that Windows considers "standard", so it wouldn't have been high end by any means. 27" displays far more commonly use 2560x1440, which is somewhat higher pixel density than 96 (I think it's 107 or 118, but I'm not looking up horizontal dimensions to do the math right now).
As for the display naming, as noted I'm not entirely sure about HR, DGF, etc. I buy and spend most of my time using U and P series models, so I don't follow the S and E lines very closely, and I'm not a gamer, so although I'm familiar with the workings of some of the technologies in that space like G-Sync, I don't keep up on the various products targeted at that market.
Anyhow, there are definitely a lot of options, and unfortunately Dell's product pages often don't contain enough tech specs to differentiate them effectively. I usually end up reading the manuals of displays I'm considering purchasing just to see as much technical info as I can and make sure there aren't any "gotchas" that wouldn't be in the marketing material, particularly since I tend to keep displays for quite a while. But as I said, if there are any particular displays you're looking at where the differences aren't entirely apparent, post here and I or someone else may be able to help.
rsteer
13 Posts
0
April 8th, 2020 12:00
Thanks for the offer of buying advice -- I basically have two paths I can follow, although I may go out to Microcenter this afternoon and just look at a few and make a choice.
(My usage is mostly business apps and browsing, with some photo editing. No gaming, no movies.)
I figured out that the onboard graphics in my Inspiron (Intel HD 4600) maxes out at regular HD (1920x1024) at 60Hz. So the path of least effort is just to buy an inexpensive "full HD" monitor. The Dells have a native refresh of 75Hz, which I like in theory, but I don't know if they'll be a little funky if the onboard only drives them at 60Hz. MSI and Acer models can sync to many signals and have "flicker-free" modes.
OR, I can buy an inexpensive video card (I want passive cooling so probably a 2GB GT-710-based card) that will allow me to go to QHD modes (not full 4K, but 2560 x whatever). Then I spend more, may or may not have more problems with font legibility, but get in theory a better image and higher refresh.
The only reason I care about refresh (since I don't game) is that I'm old-school about video -- I remember when researchers finally figured out in the '90s that refresh rates over 72Hz made screen-viewing easier on the eyes, at least in old CRT monitors. I know I could see and feel a difference. I never really understood why LCDs standardized on 60 Hz, when European and other standards mandated a minimum of 72 Hz for CRTs. I'm driving my 19" Samsung (primary) monitor at 75Hz right now. (The onboard graphics can do that for less-than-HD resolutions.)
jphughan
9 Legend
9 Legend
•
14K Posts
0
April 8th, 2020 12:00
@rsteer the Intel HD 4600 can support up to 4K 60 Hz. I have personally run that from an XPS 15 9530 that had that GPU, and I also ran dual QHD displays via DisplayPort daisy chaining from that same system.
jphughan
9 Legend
9 Legend
•
14K Posts
0
April 8th, 2020 13:00
@rsteer building on the answer above about the HD 4600 capabilities, the XPS 15 does have a discrete GPU, but that GPU does not have direct control of any display outputs. The Intel GPU is physically wired to all of that system's display outputs, so I wouldn't have been able to run those setups if the Intel 4600 itself didn't actually support them. It runs as a render-only device when needed, which is how most laptops with discrete GPUs are set up these days.
In any case, I'm fairly sure the 4600 can support dual 4K 60 Hz displays as long as the system offers the necessary display outputs to achieve that, although I never tested that setup. Newer Intel GPUs can support up to triple 4K 60 Hz.
jphughan
9 Legend
9 Legend
•
14K Posts
0
April 8th, 2020 14:00
@rsteer my aforementioned XPS 15 9530 launched in late 2013. You would need a DisplayPort 1.2 interface to run 4K 60 Hz or dual QHD though. If you're running a display from an era where 1280x1024 was available though, I expect you're using either VGA or DVI. Both of those outputs would be limited to 1920x1200 (1920x1280 isn't a resolution I've seen anywhere), since I don't think that GPU ever supported dual link DVI. So that might be why you're seeing the max that you are. And if those are the only outputs on your particular system, then you'd be stuck despite the GPU's ability to do more.
59 Hz probably refers to 59.94 Hz. Yes, that is technically distinct from 60 Hz. I can't remember why. It has something to do with some holdover from the analog era that made it into the digital era to maintain compatibility or something, just as there's 29.97 Hz as distinct from 30 Hz.
rsteer
13 Posts
0
April 8th, 2020 14:00
@jphughan> I don’t think Dell ever made a 27” 16:10 display...
I did a little searching and the Ultrasharp 2707WFP (1920x1200) looks like the one I've got two of at work; if you search for that on Amazon you'll see pictures and description. Colors are not perfect but they are REALLY nice, legible work monitors.
rsteer
13 Posts
0
April 8th, 2020 14:00
@jphughan-- Re: the Intel HD 4600 being able to do 4K. Maybe the board chipset makes a difference, or maybe I misread something. This is a Dell Inspiron 3847 with i7 and 16GB, probably circa 2013 or 2014.
I went to the device manager video properties and un-checked the box for showing only modes supported by your monitor (max 1280x1024) -- which I assumed would show everything the graphics circuitry could produce, and I think it maxed out at 1920x1024, and offered 30Hz interlaced, 59Hz (?why?), and 60Hz.
rsteer
13 Posts
0
April 25th, 2020 15:00
@jphughan > 16:10 would be 1920x1200. However, I don't recall that ever being used on a 27" display, especially an old one, and if it was, the pixel density would have been well below the 96 ppi that Windows considers "standard", so it wouldn't have been high end by any means.
[I posted a version of this reply a couple of weeks ago but it didn't seem to "stick".] I figured out that the pair I have at work are the U2707 WFP -- see this CNET review: https://www.cnet.com/reviews/dell-ultrasharp-2707wfp-lcd-monitor-27-series-review/ . List price was $1,400 when introduced.
Thanks for your advice. I ended up buying a U2415 at a local computer dealer a week ago, but will now be switching my postings to threads about "flashing" monitors, which I'd seen a couple of old references to but I was assuming (hoping) that Dell would have solved the problem in the last 4 years or so. Evidently not. I may return it next Saturday and go with another brand.
jphughan
9 Legend
9 Legend
•
14K Posts
0
April 25th, 2020 15:00
@rsteer Interesting! I never knew about this display, although for most people's use case I still don't really see the point of adding 3" of diagonal size without increasing resolution. You just end up looking at a larger but grainier version of the same image, and paying more in both monetary cost and desk space for that dubious privilege. If your use case involves having to be farther away and/or coping with challenged eyesight, then sure, but I would argue those situations don't fall into the "most people's use case" category. But Dell clearly found a market for such a display back in 2007, and judging by the continued existence of 27" 1080p displays, continues to find a market for such displays today.
Jimmy in Seneca
1 Message
0
March 4th, 2021 12:00
Why are so many websites devoid of tabular presentation of detailed specs? That's DETAILED specs, so that those of us who fund their BMW payments can make decisions easily?